About what Michael Voris said yesterday...

   On Friday (November 14, 2014) Michael Voris’ “The Vortex” (entitled The Razor’s Edge) was once again devoted to clarifying their position on Pope Francis and the fear running rampant among the faithful because of what is and isn’t coming out of the Vatican.

I am assuming (perhaps wrongly), this Vortex was done because the faithful are still contacting Church Militant TV with their concerns about the Pope and their possible confusion over where exactly Church Militant TV stands on the too often controversial hot topic of Pope Francis and the direction of the Catholic Church under his pontificate.

Here is "The Razor's Edge" from The Vortex: 

I listened to and read this episode of The Vortex over a half a dozen times – I do that quite often with what Church Militant TV produces because I respect them and want to make sure I am clearly hearing exactly what is being said- or in some cases NOT said. 

In “The Razor’s Edge” Voris gives his opinion of only two opposing sides of Catholics (the traditional leaning group who are running in fear over what Pope Francis says, does and seems to allow with his blessing) and the “Church of Nice” crowd- who refuse to admit anything is wrong at all.  Overall, Voris makes excellent points with what he says, my point in writing this is more with what he didn't say and about another side of opposing Catholics who don't fit in the groups he mentions.

Voris says:
“As of now, a careful middle seems to be being carved out – indeed, NEEDS to be carved out - amidst the flurry of hysterical responses from both extremes of the Catholic world – those angry mean-spirited Catholics who populate the ranks of so-called traditionalists – but, and this is VERY IMPORTANT – do NOT, repeat do NOT speak for the vast majority of faithful Catholics – even though they think and act like they do – AND on the other end of the spectrum – those Catholics who simply refuse to report on anything troubling – like recent affairs at the Synod, sugarcoating everything.
Battle lines have been drawn between a subset of traditional-minded Catholics who write and publish venomous screeds against the Pope, and those who pretend Rome is nothing else than a valley of lilies where everything is perfectly fine – denying the reality of what Bishop Athanasius Schneider has rightfully termed – the fourth great crisis in the life of the Church.
Both sides are wrong in their reactions because they each fail to take into account the DIFFERING damage they inflict on various individual Catholics.  Neither approach is – quite frankly “catholic”, meaning universal enough.”

Here I disagree with Voris in two respects.  Yes both sides mentioned are causing damage- though I think the damage they are causing is rather low.  Admittedly, I could be completely wrong on this.  I am sure the folks at Church Militant TV pay far more attention to many of these groups than I do.  

Yet, there is another opposing side of Catholics Voris failed to mention. 

Catholics who are not in the least bit tempted by the "subset of traditional minded Catholics who write and publish venomous screeds against the Pope" to leave the Church or the Church of Nice Catholics who bury their heads in the sand.

There are Catholics who believe the Pope is a legitimate valid pope, though not a very good one- so far at least (we still hold out hope things will improve).

Why do we feel this way?  Because we believe it is Pope Francis himself causing the MOST damage - not the hardcore traditionalists or even the Church of Nice crowd- though it is Pope Francis himself who strengthens the Church of Nice crowd when he says things like "Who am I to judge?".

 

It is Pope Francis’ OWN WORDS AND ACTIONS that are panicking people.  The hardcore traditionalists have been beating their drums for decades and the “Church of Nice” crowd has remained silent on anything and everything for just as long.

The difference now is, the Pope himself.  

Suddenly, the Church of Nice crowd have a pope leading their way to more progressive points of view INSIDE the Church (look at Cardinal Dolan and the upcoming St. Patrick's Day Parade- this is another direct effect of our current Pope on the Church).

The Pope’s words and actions are now lining up with many of the warnings the hardcore traditionalists have been warning about for decades. It's causing some Catholics to contemplate whether or not these hardcore traditionalists are right or not (their not).

So the Pope himself is sending people into the arms of religious groups OUTSIDE the Church.

That is the problem that *I* see and I believe the Vortex has not (and probably will not) address.

Voris has always made it very clear, that he and the folks at Church Militant TV have a deep concern over a SINGLE Catholic leaving the Church because of any sort of confusion or fear. 

Because of this Christian concern, Church Militant TV does their best to tread carefully in what they say and do.

That is commendable and why I have such respect for them.

This Vortex was no different in that respect.  Voris again reiterates the need to STAY IN THE CHURCH regardless of what we see and hear.

I agree completely- though I am very vocal in my distrust of our current Pope (see my sidebar for more on that- specifically those entitled "My Issues with Pope Francis: Part I and II").

One problem is, it is natural human nature to RUN when we feel fear and panic.  Most of us like our comfort zones and get very antsy when we are pushed out of it.

Sadly, Pope Francis IS pushing us out of our comfort zones- and not in any good way that I can see (I truly hope that perhaps one day I see things differently, because I don’t like the fact that I dislike and distrust my own Pope).  The result is fear and panic and for some a hasty exodus from Christ's Holy Catholic Church to something that LOOKS like what they believe is Christ's Holy Catholic Church.

I was not raised a “cradle Catholic”.  I came from outside the Church and personally KNOW how being on the outside has little to offer compare to the fullness of being inside the Church.  There is no man on earth, pope or not, who would make me look outside the Church for anything.  There is only ONE Church that Jesus Christ created on earth- there is no other.  In the words of our first Pope, St. Peter “To whom shall we go?” (John 6:68)

To whom indeed?  There is nowhere else to go.  Hold fast to what Jesus has given us, don’t allow fear to chase you from where our Lord wants you to be.  

We have a “flight or fight” instinct, yet right now too many are in full “flight” mode.  Stop.  Fight back that fear with the trust in our Lord.  He has not abandoned us- he won’t.  It is us who are abandoning Him when we leave His Holy Catholic Church for anything else.

I get it.  

Faithful Catholics are seeking comfort, stability and that homey feeling the Church used to give us, but is too often these days lacking.  I feel it too, but I won’t give in to it by abandoning the gift of the Holy Catholic Church from Christ to us because I don’t particularly like who the current Pope is.  It is MY problem to get over those fears.  It is MY cross to carry, not dump on the ground and go running for something outside the Church that gives me the “warm fuzzies”.  I belonged to the “warm fuzzy” Protestant denominations once upon a time, and I left that for a good reason.  There is no substance to those “warm fuzzies”, the true substance is with staying inside the Catholic Church no matter what.  Don’t be shaken.  Stand firm and trust in Jesus.  Period.

Voris goes on to say:
“This is the position of ChurchMilitant.TV.  We have never said the Pope, or more importantly his prudential decisions or misstatements or off the cuff personal thoughts are beyond the realm of critique.  What we consider simply out of bounds is the name-calling, Pope-bashing response of SOME, important distinction there – SOME, a few, in the more traditional minded crowd.
Here’s the bottom line.  Unless he is speaking directly on a question of faith or morals and makes it binding on all the faithful, whatever the pope says, or for that fact, ANY pope says, or sometimes doesn’t say, carries with it no guarantee of infallibility whatsoever.
THAT is why there exists a reserved set of circumstances in the first place for him to speak infallibly.  If he isn’t speaking in that very narrow set of circumstances, then it shouldn’t be regarded as infallible.”

Personally, I think Voris is dead wrong here.  

The “bottom line” isn’t about the Pope speaking infallibly – the entire world would know if the Pope was speaking infallibly- that would be clear news.  

The “bottom line” in my opinion is “WHO is driving people into a panic so awful that they are abandoning the Catholic Church for 'hardcore traditionalist' groups outside the Church?”  

In my opinion that is Pope Francis himself.  

It’s never (at least in my mind) been about infallible teaching…it’s been about the words and actions of this Pope.  

The ripple effect of “who am I to judge” and washing Muslim women’s feet during Holy week and horrible interviews and his removal of orthodox Bishops from positions inside the Church only to replace them with liberals and so on.  These actions speak VOLUMES to the “bottom line” problem Catholic laity are suffering now and it all points back to Pope Francis himself.

Pope Francis is the author of this storm we are all trying to weather.

With each news day more panic and fear is poured out to the faithful by way of off the cuff comments, liberal priests or heretical speaking Bishops.  See it for what it is…the Church is under attack.  This isn’t new or news.  But it is troubling- especially when the terror rippling across the world is seen as coming from the Vatican.

When our Holy Father FAILS to comfort his children (and let’s face it Pope Francis himself is too often the epicenter of the problems) the fear grows.

We want a Vicar on earth who will comfort us against the storms, not a Vicar who IS the storm.

The problem with that way of thinking is that good and bad Vicars come and go.  It would be WONDERFUL to again have a Vicar of Christ who kept us in our comfort zone, where we felt safe and protected against the evils in the world.  Pope Benedict did that for me.  And because he did, I naively thought ALL popes did that.  I was wrong.  Our comfort should be in our Lord himself.  Jesus sent the Great Comforter to us who will protect His Church against ALL the storms –inside and outside the Church.

Stop running OUT of the Church seeking the Comforter, you won’t find Him there.  He is INSIDE the Church- in Her Truth and official Teachings.  Find your comfort in the ONLY place it truly exists, inside the Holy Catholic Church with Jesus Christ himself.   You won’t find that anywhere else. On that, Michael Voris and I will always agree.

In Christ,

Julie @ Connecticut Catholic Corner

Source: http://www.churchmilitant.tv/scripts/vort-2014-11-14.pdf

Fr. Longenecker's Church of Nasty vs Church of Nice (UPDATED)

UPDATE AT BOTTOM!!

Recently Fr. Longenecker closed the comment box on his Patheos blog so people are no longer given the opportunity to reply to anything he says- at least not publicly.  Personally I hate that, so I have stopped going to his Patheos website- until today when I saw by way of another Catholic outlet his opinion on what he terms “Church of Nasty”.  

That reads "Nasty Catholics" vs. "Nice Catholics" to my mind because the "Nice Catholics" belong to the "Church of Nice" where they treat everyone so 'nicely'.  On the other hand, he's got the "Nasty Catholics" belonging to the "Church of Nasty".  These Catholics are described like rabid dogs on his Patheo's blog 'Standing on my head'.

  

Because there was no option to leave a comment there, I decided to write a much longer one here on my own personal thoughts of Father Longenecker's "Church of Nasty" view.  Since Father gave no links to whom he was specifically thinking of when he wrote his blog post, I can only assume based on what I myself have seen around the web- and nothing I have seen comes close to Father's depiction.  Sure, there are lots of disappointed, hurt, angry, confused, fired up Catholics out there filling the blogosphere with their thoughts and opinions but there isn't a single blogger out there that I know of which I would slap that "Nasty Catholic" label on- not one. 

So not surprisingly, I see things a bit differently than Father and I mean this with no disrespect.  Just my opinion, on his opinion.

Quote:  

[Longenecker quote] If not the Church of Nice do we need to be the Church of Nasty?

In the Catholic blogosphere and Catholic Church generally I increasingly whiff a very bad smell.It’s what I call the Church of Nasty.Trying to avoid the insipid, spineless and lily livered “Church of Nice” too many Catholic are falling into the other trap of becoming the Church of Nasty.It may be someone sending intentionally misleading headlines to a news aggregator to smear another Catholic, or it might be some guy who’s set up a super nasty website full of horrible attacks on others. It might be a radical traditionalist hell bent on attacking all the modernists and compromisers or it might be a radical progressive intent on attacking all his horrible right wing enemies. It might be some Catholic who has his knives out for Muslims, Jews and Protestants. It might be someone attacking homosexuals, sinners, modernists or feminists.  It could be a progressive launching endless attacks on traditionalists, conservatives and Republicans.Sometimes it gets so bad that it feels like, “If you don’t hate the people I hate the same way I hate them, then I hate you too!”Wherever it is coming from and wherever it is going they’re intent on being the Church of Nasty, and let me tell you it can get real ugly.I’d link to some of the poisonous websites out there, but I do not want to send them traffic or soil the unblemished minds and hearts of my dear readers…. [end quote]

Again, since Father gives no links to who or what he is referring, we are left to assume all sorts of horrid things about Catholics who are sick and tired of modernist Catholics in the Church who corrupt the teachings and bark “Who are you to judge” at you if you DARE to oppose gay rights.

Now I can see in Father's quote that he places "radical traditionalists" beside "progressives" and Catholics attacking non-Catholics beside a guy's "super nasty website".  But lets get to the heart of this.  The "Church of Nice" are those who won't speak up against anything, while the "Church of Nasty" (as he refers to them) are those who won't be silent.  

That is what it boils down to.  This (my post specifically) isn't about progressives vs. traditionalists.  It's about those who speak up and those who keep silent about ERROR among the Faithful.

"To recoil before an enemy, or to keep silence when from all sides such clamors are raised against truth, is the part of a man either devoid of character or who entertains doubt as to the truth of what he professes to believe. In both cases such mode of behaving is base and is insulting to God, and both are incompatible with the salvation of mankind." 
--Pope Leo XIII, Sapientiae Christianae

What Father neglects to mention is that those opposed to the Church of Nice didn’t start this "battle" (if you will), but they do intend to finish it because keeping silent is not an option. 

They are NOT the “Church of Nasty”, they are THE CHURCH. 

The AUTHENTIC Church- the people who believe ALL the Church teaches.  They don’t want to change the Church, they LOVE HER JUST AS SHE IS.  They despise the deceit of those who seek to ruin Her, to change Her, to mar Her magnificence with their heresies and deceit.  They won’t stop opposing heresy, sin or deceit.  And they won't be bullied into shutting up and playing "nice" when what they love is so brutally attacked. And they won't stand by in silence while souls are being lost to heresies and scandal.

These Authentic Catholics simply won’t tolerate people twisting the word “charity” to fulfill their own purpose either.  These Catholics have had enough of the Church of Nice.  

Father Longenecker says…

[quote]  Therefore, there must be a way between the insipid Church of Nice and the snarling Church of Nasty.

To stop and think it through, and give everyone the benefit of the doubt there are two different virtues vying for predominance: the virtue of charity and the virtue of truth.The Church of Nice too often sacrifice truth on the altar of charity and the Church of Nasty too often sacrifice charity on the altar of Truth.There must be a way to be both truth and charitable–both Nasty and Nice. [end quote]

You don’t understand “charity” any better than the Church of Nice does Father.  

It is NOT charitable to ignore sin or the sinner.  It is not charitable to standby biting your tongue so you don’t hurt someone’s feelings when their salvation is in jeopardy.  

It is not charitable to DO NOTHING when you see people working to destroy what you hold dear.  It is not charitable to ALLOW modernism to spread in the Church and do nothing.

Charity is love.  Love is wanting the sinner to repent so he/she can have eternal salvation.  THAT is what charity is. When progressives WORK to destroy the Faith and the "Church of Nice" remain silent so as not to cause offense that is not charity.

The Church of Nice crowd by their silence actually embraces liberalism and modernism not only in the world, but in the Church.  These people are the lukewarm who will be vomited out of God’s mouth for refusing to do anything.  

Revelation 3 - 15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold, nor hot. I would thou wert cold, or hot. 16But because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold, not hot, I will begin to vomit thee out of my mouth.

The progressive Catholics WORK to bring about legalized abominations: abortion, gay ‘marriage’, artificial birth control, embryonic research etc, while the Church of Nice crowd smile at them and wave at them marching with their gay pride banners.  

The Church of Nice crowd wouldn’t dare tell someone their sin might lead them to hell because it might offend them, so instead they smile and keep silent as they watch souls going to Hell. 

This is NOT charity, it is hatred, selfishness and cowardice. 

Authentic Catholics WORK to stop modernism and heresy. Authentic Catholics aren't afraid to risk themselves for the sake of another- even if it comes with a cost.

If Uncle Bobo and his partner invite you to their 'wedding' it is NOT charity to accept and bring them a gift.

The most charitable thing you can do is sit down with them (or write to them if they won't meet with you) and tell them WHY you can't support them and why their relationship is a sin.

That is truly loving them and wanting the best for them.

Buying them a gift and attending their "wedding" because they are "nice guys" and you don't want to "offend" them is NOT an act of charity. 

You have an opportunity to HELP someone avoid MORTAL sin...you WILL be held accountable for how you respond to that opportunity.

Charity is loving others enough to RISK being hated, rejected and mocked because you hold another person's salvation MORE VALUABLE than your self pride or ego.  You are willing to be mocked, humiliated and hated if it helps even ONE soul turn from sin and return to God.

All the evils of the world are due to lukewarm Catholics.

-Pope St. Pius V

The Church of Nice crowd will never risk themselves for another.  They are too selfish and comfortable to do what Jesus commanded.  Picking up our crosses and following Jesus is NOT easy, and often it is NOT comfortable.  It was not supposed to be.

When Catholics stand by and say NOTHING when Cardinals lead parades with gay banners declaring the right to gay ‘marriage’ that is NOT charity.  

When Catholics stand by and do NOTHING when priests march for women priests it is NOT charity.  

When Catholics stand by allowing ‘Catholic’ politicians to support abortion, birth control, gay ‘marriage’ and adoption it is NOT charity.  

When Catholics stand by and do NOTHING when Catholic clergy cause scandal it is NOT charity.

All the strength of Satan’s reign is due to the easy-going weakness of Catholics.

-Pope St. Pius X

He that sees another in error, and endeavors not to correct it, testifies himself to be in error.

-Pope Leo I

Not to oppose error, is to approve it, and not to defend truth is to suppress it, and indeed to neglect to confound evil men, when we can do it, is no less a sin than to encourage them.

-Pope Felix III

Catechism #826 Charity is the soul of the holiness to which all are called: it "governs, shapes, and perfects all the means of sanctification." ²⁹⁷If the Church was a body composed of different members, it couldn't lack the noblest of all; it must have a Heart, and a Heart BURNING WITH LOVE. And I realized that this love alone was the true motive force which enabled the other members of the Church to act; if it ceased to function, the Apostles would forget to preach the gospel, the Martyrs would refuse to shed their blood. LOVE, IN FACT, IS THE VOCATION WHICH INCLUDES ALL OTHERS; IT'S A UNIVERSE OF ITS OWN, COMPRISING ALL TIME AND SPACE - IT'S ETERNAL! ²⁹⁸

Hmmm...now WHO does that sound like??  Oh yeah, the Church of Nice!

It is not the “Church of Nice” who reminds Catholics they need to attend weekly Mass.  When Catholics  no longer believe the Eucharist is what the Church says it is, it is not the Church of Nice who correct them.  Oh no, that might hurt their feelings. 

It is not the “Church of Nice” crowd who encourages Catholics to go to Confession when they learn a brother or sister has fallen to mortal sin.  Oh no, that might upset them and “who are we to judge” them anyway?  If they don’t believe in sin or the need to confess because they think God is sooo nice that He won’t allow THEM to go to Hell- the Church of Nice crowd won’t correct that thinking.  Oh no, Hell is for the Hitler’s of the world, not Catholics who love each other.

What unity do Authentic Catholics (those who believe ALL the Church teaches) have with the “Church of Nice” crowd who support (by their silence and smiles) unrepented sin and modernism in the Church?

The Church of Nice crowd don’t understand charity because they have interpreted the word to be an inactive term. Charity is something we DO.  It is action, not in-action.  The Church of Nice crowd are in-active pew warmers. 

Catholic Catechism #1792 Ignorance of Christ and his Gospel, bad example given by others, enslavement to one's passions, assertion of a mistaken notion of autonomy of conscience, rejection of the Church's authority and her teaching, lack of conversion and of charity: these can be at the source of errors of judgment in moral conduct.

Do Authentic Catholics get angry when they see Cardinal’s leading parades with gay pride banners?  You bet.

Do Authentic Catholics get angry when they see Catholic priests attending gay pride parades causing scandal to the faithful?  You bet.

Do Authentic Catholics get angry when they see Catholic Bishops more concerned with political issues like immigration reform than teaching the Faith?  You bet.

Do Authentic Catholics get angry when they see "Catholic" politicians supporting artificial birth control, abortion and gay marriage while their priests and Bishops turn a blind eye?  You bet!

Do Authentic Catholics get angry when they see authentic parishes being closed down in favor of liberal dying parishes?  You bet.

You can call these Catholics “Church of Nasty” if you want to Father Longenecker, but I will call them AUTHENTIC CATHOLICS and God will never vomit them out of His mouth for being lukewarm Church of Nice pew warmers.

"If I have against me all the Bishops, 

I have with me all the Saints and Doctors of the Church"

-St. Thomas Aquinas

In Christ,

Julie @ Connecticut Catholic Corner

****Since Father Longenecker’s comment box is closed feel free to use my comment box to share your thoughts on Father’s article or my own.  I’d like to hear from both the “Church of Nice” and the “Church of Nasty”(or as I like to call you, Authentic Catholics) crowds.

Patheos link: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/standingonmyhead/2014/09/church-of-nice-or-church-of-nasty.html

UPDATE:
Father Longenecker and I have been going back and forth in emails over this post I wrote.  In his first email he indicates I was "biased", "unfair" and had gotten worked up into a "lather un-necessarily".
Why did he feel this way?  Because I didn't quote this particular part of his blog post (I reminded Father I linked to his blog so that people could read it in its entirety).

Quote: Some Catholics talk disparagingly of the “Church of Nice”

They are referring to the modernist church where indifferentism, complacency and tolerance replace the truly Christian virtues. They object not to niceness, but to a church that is nothing but nice.I’m with them. I can’t stand watered down religion. Modernist Christianity has eviscerated the gospel, removed the supernatural, “de mythologized” the message and turned Catholicism into nothing more than a do gooder religion for the country club set.As one commentator has observed, “This ain’t a religion. It’s a set of table manners.”I have written on this blog constantly of the danger to real Catholicism of removing the miraculous and robbing the church of the one power she has: the supernatural power of the sacraments, the fullness of the magisterium, the power of the Holy Spirit and the fullness of truth in the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.When Some Catholics sneer at the “Church of Nice” I’m sympathetic.Let’s not tame the lion or water down the wine. Let’s hold to a full blooded, rip snortin’, Rooster Cogburn Catholicism.

Ok, so I have now added the quote Father felt was necessary to share here.  I am not sure that changes anything, but I am willing to update my blog for my readers to see what Father Longenecker really wants you all to see.

I'd also like to add that Father gave me the link to the "Church of Nasty" website that influenced his blog post.  Personally, I don't even think it is Catholic- and I told him so- seems more anti-Catholic but I will let you all decide.

I will share the offending link with my readers so you can decide for yourselves.  
Be warned it is hateful and trashes the Holy Catholic Church.

Here is the link Father Longenecker gave me in email: HERE

Note this hate filled blog has no comments and I can see no followers so I don't think its having much of an impression on anyone.

Father and I were respectful of each other even though we saw this situation very differently.  We had (in my opinion) a good conversation about all of this and I am happy he decided to write to me to share his thoughts on what I wrote.

OK, that's it.  Just wanted to update this story.

God bless!